it may be a little too late for the question but i wuz astounded that i wuz actually one foot away from someone who told me that she hated the matrix reloaded today!!!!!!! :eek: :eek:

i couldn't believe it!
so it made me wonder.... is there anyone else out there? i wuzn't paying attention when the movie came out at who liked it or not.


so.....

Loved it...only just. The burly brawl was a farce, for crying out loud!

i liked it for the mere eye candy of it, (i like sci fi and FX) but it surely did not deserve all the hype and marketing it had...

at least now for Matrix 3 the marketing is a bit "normal"

people start to hate movie (usually summer movies) when the marketing machine behind it is sooooo big driving the expectation so high... (ex. Godzilla, ID4, Star Wars EP 1 ... etc)
look at Finding Nemo, its marketing was "normal" but still its the years biggest movie coz if it's good people will simply spread it around and see it.

but there are some BIG movies that deserved all its marketing, the LOTR movies, eventhough IMO its simply a big croud pleaser with out any great value in it

I'm holding my judgement on Reloaded till I see Revolutions. I can neither say I liked or hated it, because I still didn't see the complete picture.

Same as The Two Towers. I didn't read the novel, so I felt similarily cheated at the end of the movie.

They both put a basis on a first great part and their ending was much more open.

They're unlike Episode 2, which set itself as a complete movie (its quality is another issue).

Hated Reloaded. Crap acting, carppy prententious story, effects ranging from the amazing (little unimportant scenes) to the just plain crap (burley brawl). Cheesey stomping agent in the car chase was a mistake, editing was horrible, so was the soundtrack. Having ghosts warewolves vampires ect... didn't fit, and Neo spent too much time flying!!!

Originally posted by trailergod

but there are some BIG movies that deserved all its marketing, the LOTR movies, eventhough IMO its simply a big croud pleaser with out any great value in it Well I guess you missed the entire point then. Are you forgetting about it's themes of over coming predudice, the themes of technologies destruction of nature, as well as it's exploratioin of growth and courage. You're right no real merit beyond special effects in the Rings films. :rolleyes:

one of the best movie i saw!!

i agree a great and lovely movie....very imaginative....the characters accomplish nearly every move i would have wished to have done if i had super powers.....greatly love it !!
LOVE IT LOVE IT LOVE IT and yes i like it more then matrix 1....and yes i love love love matrix 1 aswell.....and greatly lookin for the third installment

Reloaded was killed by overuse of bad CGI.... thats what it comes down to... it tryed to hard and fell on its face....

Btw this is my first post on thise bords... have been looking in for almost a year now and never posted cos i f***ed up my first Nick and couldent post :) hehe.... but now it works... and im looking forword to spaming thise bords with my bad english grammor and useless opinions :P hehe

Fed7haS

Sorry to say it. But F*****************CK.

I'm sick of people claiming that Reloaded had bad CGI. Give me ONE damn example. :confused: :upset:

Originally posted by Dr.FrankNFurter
Reloaded was killed by overuse of bad CGI.... thats what it comes down to... it tryed to hard and fell on its face....

Btw this is my first post on thise bords... have been looking in for almost a year now and never posted cos i f***ed up my first Nick and couldent post :) hehe.... but now it works... and im looking forword to spaming thise bords with my bad english grammor and useless opinions :P hehe

Fed7haS

great

Originally posted by wireframe9
Sorry to say it. But F*****************CK.

I'm sick of people claiming that Reloaded had bad CGI. Give me ONE damn example. :confused: :upset:

Well the Mega Fight with Neo and Mr. Smith was the worst... that killed the movie for me...

The problem i have with that scene is that you (at the last 50% of the fight) have CGI fighting CGI and thats not what i whant to se... if i did i would have watched the intro to Max Payne 2 or some other videogame...

I would rather have an old badly synked Jackie Chan movie... at least there you have kickass action where you can go WOW and Ohhh when somthing cool hapens... with the smith fight the only thing that whent throu my head was how bad it looked...

Another thing is the Agent jumping onto the car on the freeway... talk about bad CGI.... i mean if you liked that scene you will only do so cos you whant to like it... and that can only be cos you have the matrix cash cow so far up your *** that you wouldent know a good movie if it hit you on the face :)

Fed7haS

Originally posted by Dr.FrankNFurter
Well...Bla bla about the Blurry Brawl and The Car Chase Exactly, the films 2 most important effects scenes featured some of the worst effects in recent memory. :freak:
Welcome to the boards, don't worry about your bad grammar, most people here speak Engliush second anyway, and if you disliked The Matrix Reloaded then you're extremely welcome. :big grin:

Look at the bit where he flys in the air with the pole. No, don't slo-mo it! :rolleyes:

???????

Nevermind, I won't argue with you.

But to comment about your "matrix cash cow" idea, all I can say is that I'm very much interested in Visual Effects. And that's the career I'm planning to get into. I read A LOT, and I can assure you that Reloaded did what George Lucas fantasied of doing in Episode 2.

Hey, we posted at the same time. Cool. :)

Yeah. Don't do that again!! :P No one should try to compete with me. :D :big grin:

LOL :D

Originally posted by I Got Trailers
Look at the bit where he flys in the air with the pole. No, don't slo-mo it! :rolleyes: You mean the Blur? The effect that can be achieved just as easily by throwing a tub of paint at the wall?

Originally posted by wireframe9
???????

Nevermind, I won't argue with you.

But to comment about your "matrix cash cow" idea, all I can say is that I'm very much interested in Visual Effects. And that's the career I'm planning to get into. I read A LOT, and I can assure you that Reloaded did what George Lucas fantasied of doing in Episode 2. I've got to ask, but as an experienced person, how would you define good effects? At the moment everyone who has said the Matrix had excellent effects have said just that, and everyone who claims it's bad has those 2 examples, yet now you say they looked good?

Is a good effect a believable effects, because if so the Burley Brawl wasn't believable, it looked fake. Is it realism, if so it looked fake. Is it just abut being impressive, if so it looked fake. What is the guidline for a good effect?:whistle:

In the Burly Brawl, Neo jumps into the air with a pole (very dodgy CG), it goes into slo-mo bulletime while he's in midair (dodgier CG) and lands, hitting at least two Smiths. And let's not forget that you can see the stuntmen's different hair styles when they leave the park.

Well, my vote now makes it 11-4, loved vs hated it, and I'd hafta say that I enjoyed the flic. It's a good popcorn movie .. yeah, I agree that they went a little too nuts with some of the CG scenes but overall it was cool .. I think to be fair that we'll all see how this pans out with the final chapter in the trilogy at the start of November.

The DVD's video is awesome (first disk devoted to just the movie) and the 5.1 surround mix is very well done too .. really nice on the home theatre!

:cool:

I've got to ask, but as an experienced person, how would you define good effects?

Let's have a little chat :)

First, answering your question; a good effects shot is the one that helps convey the story.

Second, when talking about The Matrix, and specifically Revolutions, and specifically when are inside "the virtual reality of the matrix", REALISM isn't what the directors intend. I don't mean they want the effects to look bad, but I that what they are actually doing is drawing us a fake reality.

When I first saw the Reloaded teaser, and on the first scene of it, I immediately realized what approah the Waschowski's are going with respect to the CGI. That's why I wasn't disappointed by fake CGI, as I already knew from the very begining what they were illustrating.

Comics! The Matrix was inspired by comics. And bullet-time was a means of giving life to comics. The comic feel was even evident in the poster of the first movie, were we've the lower part of the image painted, not photographed!

As for Reloaded's teaser, and as Trinity is firing while she was jumping, we can clearly see by your definitions of CGI that the fire from her pistol was fake. But then again, can't they make something as easy as this? It has to be intended. It's intended.

I took lots of the scenes you term bad as having a comic feel to them. And my best one is when Neo flies vertically in the air and the camera rotates slightly around him. You should've said according to your believes that this is more fake than the Burly Brawl scene.

As for other parts of the movie, I can tell you that I in no way can understand how they made lots of them. Whether it's CGI, some photography trick, miniature or what, I can't tell. And this I think is an achievment of its one.

I posted this (http://www.inbinary.com/public/reloaded_flying_cam.avi) before. It's one of the best camera shots I ever saw. If you, or anyone else, can tell me more about how it was done, I would be glad :)

Well, it is a long stretch to say I "loved" Matrix Reloaded, but I didn't hate it, either, so I am not going to vote in either selection.

I was, however, dissapointed with it. There wasn't a lot to offer other than a lot of spectacular fight sequences, and it takes a bit more than good fight scenes for me to like the movie.

I am holding off buying Matrix Reloaded on DVD until I see Revolutions. If I like Revolutions, then I will pick up Reloaded. If Revolutions is more of the same as Reloaded, I will ignore both of them and stick with the original. Although if I happen to get Reloaded as a gift, I will keep it.

And I will jump into the CGI debate only long enough to say that the fight between Neo and the Smiths looked and felt awfully cartoony. I half expected Bugs Bunny to pop up somewhere. Otherwise, I thought the CGI was pretty good.

Originally posted by corfy
If Revolutions is more of the same as Reloaded,

dude, if that happens, i will be so pissed off! there's better be a war!!!!!!!! :P

It was ok...I had to actually watch it twice to comprehend what the Architect was saying at the end...the first time, I was just stunned. :P

But to be honest, we all just watched the first part of a two part movie...it would be like trying to write a review on the first part of Braveheart, or the first part of the Piano, or the first part of Titanic...ohhh god, that would really be awful to watch the first part of Titanic, and then have to go see the 2nd part of it, 4 months down the road. :big grin:

You just need to see the whole picture, before you can really review the movie.

But I will say this...my expectations were very very disapointed. I was hoping to capture that same feel of awwwww and wonder that I had from the first Matrix...didn't happen with this one.

Also, I don't understand why they didn't just use the "construct" thingy to get an EMP device...to use on the power grid thingy. It would have been more practical and less risky...than that three pronged simultaneous assault. :whistle:

The problem with CGI thise days is that now its used for the most part cos its cheap.... in the past it was only used to make the totaly imposibel posibel...

In my opinion good Special FX is the best when you dont se em.... if done right you will never notice that you have been fooled... like a god close up magician :) take a movie like Dark City... not alot of eye candy... but under the surface there are tons of FX and you dont even notice until you watch the extras on the dvd :) now thats good FX... in Reloadet it was like HERE COMES THE FX!!!!! and sorry but that dosent tickel me :)

In The Matrix the best FX shot wasent even CGI.. (the shot where Neo dodes the agents bullets) that was made with alot of still camras and a few movie camras.... only CGI was the ring Like trails of the bullits... now thats what i call a cool use of SFX.... cos it dident overuse CGI... i would have bet you anything that had they done that scene in Reloadet then it would have been 95% CGI... dont know why they whent overbord.....

Ill take an good old Indiana Jones movie any day.... :)

Fed7haS

PS : wireframe9

That clip you postet showing the fight on the truck was made 95% CGI... they filmed the actors on a flat truck top and the rest is CGI... all the other cars the briges and all that stuff... they are standing on the ground in a Green room :)

Originally posted by Dr.FrankNFurter
The problem with CGI thise days is that now its used for the most part cos its cheap....

and less dangerous!!! :rolleyes:


so he should try and smack that pole at all of those guys?

oh and that agent should really jump out of his car and jump on the moving vehicle on the freeway and then jump on to the next!


and and morpheus should jump toward head-to-head that 18 wheeler truck- right?

and they really should have just went ahead and kept them on top of the truck while it crashed so it could look more real....


i see what you mean now.... those damn fools using CGI... :P

two words - FREEWAY CHASE!

the sheer amount of SFX makes it good but if you look at each scene alone it sucks

I didn't hate and I just might learn to love it if Revolutions is more conclusive

I've just gotta say this. The best use of CGI was in Forrest Gump. All of it was for the story. But the best CGI was in the first Jurassic Park, the kitchen scene, can't tell when CGI ends and animatronics begin.

you make a good point there... if CGI is used to make an FX that would in the old days have been made with lets say a big rubber mask and costume... like King Kong or a Dinasore... thats cool cos thats the best way to do it.... but when they start to CGI ppl thats just lame...

Fed7haS

B-E-A-Utiful

PS : wireframe9

That clip you postet showing the fight on the truck was made 95% CGI... they filmed the actors on a flat truck top and the rest is CGI... all the other cars the briges and all that stuff... they are standing on the ground in a Green room

And how do you like that as an effects shot?

Look, I didn't say the movie was great. I said I couldn't judge it before Revolutions comes. Actually, when I saw its ending "to be concluded", I said: WTF?

I also felt that several scenes we prolonged, like the Agent Fight and the Freeway chase. And other parts went too fast like the last 20 minutes.

All this is one thing and my opinion about how great the CGI were is another one. I knew the shot I sent had to be CG, becuase it's hardly possible that any camera takes a path like that, and that's one of the reasons why I loved the CG work in Reloaded. 'Seamless Integration' as they say.

Originally posted by wireframe9

And how do you like that as an effects shot?

Look, I didn't say the movie was great. I said I couldn't judge it before Revolutions comes. Actually, when I saw its ending "to be concluded", I said: WTF?

I also felt that several scenes we prolonged, like the Agent Fight and the Freeway chase. And other parts went too fast like the last 20 minutes.

All this is one thing and my opinion about how great the CGI were is another one. I knew the shot I sent had to be CG, becuase it's hardly possible that any camera takes a path like that, and that's one of the reasons why I loved the CG work in Reloaded. 'Seamless Integration' as they say. [/B]

Sure the scene ou posted was great... and i dident say it wasent.... :) there was alot of GREAT cgi in reloadet... but also alot of the worst i have ever seen.... i kept thinking (during the neo vs smith fight) why on earth did they relese this crap? cant they se its just to lame and fake? and thats not how i whant to feal when watching a movie... the same fealing killed TombRaider 2 for me... when she hit the shark the movie died... i couldent for the life of me take it serius after that....

But dont get me wrong i will se the 3 matrix movie... and i realy hope it makes up for the shortcommings of reloadet... but even if it dose i will still regard Reloadet + Revulotions as one movie and The matrix as one movie.... they are best kept apart...

Fed7haS

Originally posted by radstar
and less dangerous!!! :rolleyes:


so he should try and smack that pole at all of those guys?

oh and that agent should really jump out of his car and jump on the moving vehicle on the freeway and then jump on to the next!


and and morpheus should jump toward head-to-head that 18 wheeler truck- right?

and they really should have just went ahead and kept them on top of the truck while it crashed so it could look more real....


i see what you mean now.... those damn fools using CGI... :P Radstar go an watch a Jackie Chan movie, and see a guy do, almost, all that you have mentioned without CGI. That's why I don't really enjoy most American action movies, most stuntwork is computer generated, and you can tell it's computer generated so it detracts from the sense of danger.

Originally posted by carl
Radstar go an watch a Jackie Chan movie, and see a guy do, almost, all that you have mentioned without CGI. That's why I don't really enjoy most American action movies, most stuntwork is computer generated, and you can tell it's computer generated so it detracts from the sense of danger.

100% my point thats why i mentioned Jackie Chan in the first place....

:)

Fed7haS

Just don't see The Tuxedo...that's loaded with CGI.

okay i've seen a lot of jackie chan movies... i own a few... and i see fights..... jumps from the back.... more fights.......


the fights are real in the matrix reloaded but it's the ACTION!!! name one jackie chan movie that has an extreme action like the matrix reloaded, i.e. The Burly Brawl

and i will go rent it. :)



and what makes the Matrix Reloaded so cool is that it didn't involve Jackie Chan... it involved an inexperience guy who went thru training and heck- he got good!

jackie chan had been doing this since he wuz 2 weeks old.... :P

usually when i think of karate, i think of chinese/japenese/korean...... i'm now trying to think of an american guy who have ever done a karate movie... :angel"

Originally posted by radstar
okay i've seen a lot of jackie chan movies... i own a few... and i see fights..... jumps from the back.... more fights.......


the fights are real in the matrix reloaded but it's the ACTION!!! name one jackie chan movie that has an extreme action like the matrix reloaded, i.e. The Burly Brawl

and i will go rent it. :)



and what makes the Matrix Reloaded so cool is that it didn't involve Jackie Chan... it involved an inexperience guy who went thru training and heck- he got good!

jackie chan had been doing this since he wuz 2 weeks old.... :P

usually when i think of karate, i think of chinese/japenese/korean...... i'm now trying to think of an american guy who have ever done a karate movie... :angel" LOL, good.

Good one. I'd say adequate for American audiences would describe Reeves kung fu skills.

Anyway BIG stunts, Police Story 3 Michelle Yeoh drives a motorbike off a hill to land on a moving train real stunt, she did it herself on the same day she learned to drive a bike. Now that's impressive.

Rumble In The Bronxe, Jackie Chan jumps from a building to another, no wires, no fake building, no CGI. Big drop!!!

was it Armour Of God where Jackie Chan jumps a big gap, lands on a small ledge and continues, only first attempt he missed, hit his head bad and nearly died. Now he's left with a permanant, penny sized hole in his skull. That's real stunt work,

However if you're looking for a fight where a badly CGI man morphs himself into 1000000 different versions and attack simultaniously, then no it's not possible to do. Still doesn't hold any sense of risk though, and still would have been much better with only 5 Agent Smiths so that they could have used real people. :whistle:

like i said..... chinese/japenese/korean :P

Rumble in the Bronxe- not even a net under?

Jackie Chan is crazy and that makes him a HELL of an actor!!

keanu reeves is just cute :P and i like computer graphics... okay? now don't bite my bag.. just my @$$ okay? thanks.... :)

Originally posted by radstar
now don't bite my bag
Was that a confession? :eek:

You can like CGI, just can't call them stunts, or skillfull, or difficult, just expensive. :P

I did'nt mind Reloaded, It was not half the movie The Matrix was. There was too much CGI in Reloaded, it turned out a little like Episode 2...CGI should be used to enhance the movie, not make the movie.

Originally posted by cromulas
I did'nt mind Reloaded, It was not half the movie The Matrix was. There was too much CGI in Reloaded, it turned out a little like Episode 2...CGI should be used to enhance the movie, not make the movie.

100% how i feal... Attack Of The Clones was a joke... CGI killed it.... IMO the first 3 movies in the StarWars saga... was all more convincing and not as fake as Episode 1-2....

The thing is that they whent over the top with out needing to.... take a movie like Raiders of the lost ark Now thats a cool action movie... but it still dosent involve 2000 Indiana jones doing epic battel agenst nazi troops... and it dosent need to... it can be exiting, cool, thrilling, and DAMN GOOD!!! without CGI....

My point is i would rather se neo fight 1 Smith in a kickass Kung Fu fight... then se him fight 1000 in a lame *** CGI peace of **** :)

Fed7haS

100% how i feal... Attack Of The Clones was a joke... CGI killed it

Are you jokin? Was Attack Of The Clones meant to be a movie? I thought G. Lucas made it as a demo reel to advertise ILM's abilities. :)

hmmm, reloaded was a soso film. a promising story that was stuck in way too much vfx and as chris mentioned before it's overhyped. on the vfx site for part 1 i can simply say they are not great neither revolutionary and they didn't deserve the oscar for best vfx. what was so great about we had never seen before? bullet time??? yeah right :evil: nothing new. i saw similiar stuff before, well just freezed frame but similiar. theyy just made the next step and when u see the bullet time on the roof all the dead bodies are gone and the fight between neo and shmith in the subway station is also very simple made and the rest of the films vfx are not great. for me was episode 1 the true winner for best vfx and that film had revolutionary vfx rather then evolutionary vfx like the matrix. ilm had the first real intergration of a belieable cgi character, yes jar jar, 2nd they had clothsimulation and they droidarmy was simply brilliant. all those little details u see in episode 1 you simply miss in the matrix. for reloaded they had 1 year more then george lucas for episode 2 and still they can't catch up with ilm. many scenes where so obvious cgi that i could puke. see all scnes neo flys or burly brawl. ok that scenes had to be made in cg because of the camera moves and all thoses smiths but on the other hand i wasn't surprise by all that cg stuff they put in the movie.

Originally posted by wireframe9
Are you jokin? Was Attack Of The Clones meant to be a movie? I thought G. Lucas made it as a demo reel to advertise ILM's abilities. :)

Im almost 100% sure it was a movie.... dont hang me if im wrong :big grin:

Final Fantasy = Matrix Reloadet

With the first beaing the better of the 2 :)

Fed7haS

Please. Final Fantasy?

I was anticipating that movie like hell. My opinion of it became one of the worst not after watching the movie, but after watching the DVD.

The script sucked, but then lots of movies don't have a good one. But when one of the animators comes in the DVD and says that the movie made him believe in Gaia. And that he's so relieved that his deceased mother is now in the heart of the Earth.... :cry: :freak:

After that, I had no doubt why this movie failed. :D

Originally posted by wireframe9
Please. Final Fantasy?

I was anticipating that movie like hell. My opinion of it became one of the worst not after watching the movie, but after watching the DVD.

The script sucked, but then lots of movies don't have a good one. But when one of the animators comes in the DVD and says that the movie made him believe in Gaia. And that he's so relieved that his deceased mother is now in the heart of the Earth.... :cry: :freak:

After that, I had no doubt why this movie failed. :D

hehe i dident say Final Fantasy was good... i just stated that it was better then MatriX Reloadet :D

Come on look at the Neo vs 1000 Smiths scene... its like a Cut out scene from FF :whistle:

Fed7haS

I loved the fight. As I said before, I took their work as a comic approach. How did you like DareDevil by the way?

As for Final Fantasy, they really had a serious problem with object weights. Even in the most simple situations, their mass covers air in far less than it's supposed to!

As for DareDevil i dident like it.... dident like spiderman eather for that matter.... hulk bumed out for me to :( Hmmmm the only SuperHero movie i liked was X-men and X-Men 2 i think...

Fed7haS

ur so picky!!!!!! :P :P

I agree.

If you don't like DareDevil then there's no doubt you wouldn't say Reloaded's CGI is fake. :)

DareDevil is like you're reading a comic book. This is no metaphor. There were nearly no realism in this movie. But then this doesn't mean it's fake.

The director choose to direct a comic book. That's what he has done. Most of his camera angels were.... comic!! One from below, one from above... etc. They're not the realistic angles we're used to in movies or real life, like a behind the shoulders view.

That's why I call DareDevil "a true comic book adaptation".

Well the reason i dont like DD is not cos of CG.... has nothing to do with the visuals of the film for that matter....

Fed7haS

Originally posted by wireframe9
Please. Final Fantasy?

I was anticipating that movie like hell. My opinion of it became one of the worst not after watching the movie, but after watching the DVD.

The script sucked, but then lots of movies don't have a good one. But when one of the animators comes in the DVD and says that the movie made him believe in Gaia. And that he's so relieved that his deceased mother is now in the heart of the Earth.... :cry: :freak:

After that, I had no doubt why this movie failed. :D
So you didn't like the story of Final Fantasy, but it still had a strong story. Philosophical, deep and generally a technical marvel in more area's then CGI. Had a huge argument with Trailergod in another thread over wheether FF was a case of a bad story, or a story he didn't like. :ninja:

Matrix Reloaded had shallow Philosophy 101 stuff. As for Daredevil I felt it was fun, had no problems with it's visual effects but felt there were way too many plot holes for it's good.

Phew, did I miss off any thread tangents?

Less time I checked, Carl, no.

Matrix Reloaded had shallow Philosophy 101 stuff.

Yeah, it was only necessary to discuss the choice theory once or twice, but 4 TIMES!!!

What are 'thread tangents'?

Originally posted by wireframe9

Yeah, it was only necessary to discuss the choice theory once or twice, but 4 TIMES!!!

What are 'thread tangents'? [/B]

when i saw Reloadet i felt like the movie was telling me

"NOW!!! listen up you moron we know you have the IQ of a labrat so we will FORCEFEED you with this **** untill you CHOKE on it.... and meaby even KILLS you!!!"

Fed7haS

:cry: :cry:


i only asked if you liked it or not..... :(

Originally posted by wireframe9

Yeah, it was only necessary to discuss the choice theory once or twice, but 4 TIMES!!!

What are 'thread tangents'? [/B] A thread tangent is a fancy word for sudden offtopic, I left last night with everyone discussing Reloaded, came back and they were talking about Daredevil, after they had finished discussing Final Fantasy.

Originally posted by radstar
:cry: :cry:


i only asked if you liked it or not..... :( and some of us only told you we hate it beyond all measure. :ninja:

man i like checking in to see these 3 or 4 in 1 tangent threads....here is my input :

bad cgi is when you can see that it is cg. the perfect effect is when you can't tell that it was CG. take the Hunt for Red October. almost all the underwater scenes were cg and no one could tell until the making came out (and boy was i shocked to see that)....

reloaded had bad use of cg because it looked fake. granted i'm not talking about the plot aspects of "well, he is a god-like being because he is in the matrix and all that crap..." it is because one second you can tell it is neo and the next second it is a bold-face fake (cg) ...that is bad use.

matrix had nothing that lucas wanted. if it did, then Ep2 would have been star wars, episode two: star wars reloaded....but it wasn't...

daredevil really was the worst movie that i saw (i didn't even waste my time on gigli). ben afflect is one of today's worst actors. so isn't jennifer lopez. it was not a true comic book adaption either. the king pin wasn't black. at least i would read daredevil the comic but i wouldn't waste an ounce of breathe on this crap movie.

again, my opinion...

Okay, just got one question:

How many of you, either love it or hate it, see Reloaded (either in cinemas, on DVDs, or bootleg divx DLs) only once to-date?

Cos, if you're like me, who only saw it one time when it came out, it shouldn't make much of an impression 6 months later.

The CGI effects're not that memorable for a one-time viewing. I only remembered those bits I've seen numberous times in the trailers. The only thing I can remember clearly is the sting I felt when I saw in the end credits the name of a girl in the same tute of mine at uni.

I was too busy to worry about the overcrowded threatre, those boring bits with The Architect and Zion dance/sex scene.

Please, it's just a movie. And not even the best of 2003.

Originally posted by carl
and some of us only told you we hate it beyond all measure. :ninja:


yah and no need to keep on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on!!!!!!



i love the matrix reloaded and ya'll shoud be respective! :)
i respect that you hate it and i'm not going on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on why it's so great! :rolleyes: :P

Originally posted by radstar
yah and no need to keep on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on!!!!!!



i love the matrix reloaded and ya'll shoud be respective! :)
i respect that you hate it and i'm not going on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on why it's so great! :rolleyes: :P That's because theirs no supportive argument for MR. You like it because you like it, but we who hate it have sooooo much to work with its not funny.:whistle:

Originally posted by red bear
bad cgi is when you can see that it is cg. the perfect effect is when you can't tell that it was CG. take the Hunt for Red October. almost all the underwater scenes were cg and no one could tell until the making came out (and boy was i shocked to see that)....


well that is totaly wrong. all the underwater scenes in red october where shot in smoke with a huge rig. later they add partical and a ripple effect so you think the subs are in water.

Originally posted by bender
well that is totaly wrong. all the underwater scenes in red october where shot in smoke with a huge rig. later they add partical and a ripple effect so you think the subs are in water.

The point is not how it was mad... the point is it looked real... :)

The same goes for a movie like Jurasic Park... we know that the Dinasures dont exist so they have to be fake... but still it was sooooo well done that it was without a doubt belivabel....

The problem with Reloadet is that it dosent even come close to beaing belivabel.... thats why i compared it to Final Fantasy...

Let me make an Exampel here :) take a movie like The Core... (witch i think sucked btw) and look at the CG... its on a buget thats 10% of the buget Reloadet was made on but still it was alot more belivabel.... not ounce while whatching the movie did i think "Thats just Fake" ..... and thats even tho i 100% knew it was.... hope this makes sence its hard for me to explain myself 100% in english :)

fed7haS

who made the CGI FX in Matrix 2, 3 anyway? i'm sure its not ILM...

who is the in house effects house of WBro?

Animal Logic & Manex did the visual effects for the first film. For the second and third; Animal Logic, Sony Pictures ImageWorks and Pixel Liberation Front.

Visual Effects Supervisor for the 3 movies is John Gaeta.

i just spent a while reading through the threads.. and so far all arguments have been solid... i loved reloaded.. if only for the fight scenes.. i buy dvd's to serve a purpose.. once i have seen a movie i might not watch the entire movie again for years.. however i will sometimes put a disc in and skip to my favorite chapters.. that said.. matrix reloaded will be my "fight scene" dvd for a long time coming.. only because it is visually and audibly superior to anything else i own...

thats my opinion of the movie..

the only comment that i disagreed with was carl's opinion about the burly brawl.. 5 SMITHS!!! the whole point is smith is taking over the matrix.. any fool could see that coming.. and its hinted at big time in the last trailer for revolutions... how on earth could 5 smiths pose a threat to the matrix.. .well duh.. they need more.. much more.. and if you were in smiths position and had the ability to clone yourself would you stop at 5.. give me a break! if you're going to pick on that.. at least pick on the fact that the smiths just walk away at the end of the fight!

as for the use of CG in the movie.. it is justified! and it looks fine.. i have been doing graphics and working with video for 3 years... and i had to stop the movie and go through frame by frame with zoom to pick out the faults (and thats on a new widescreen television)... and if you can seriously pick out a single frame that is moving at 1/25th of a second then your basically a physical anomolie.. FACT your eyes cant take in information that quickly.. as for the frames in succession.. if you can pick out that skin tone and texture is noticably different from the wide angles then you're lying... dont waste our time. point is.. i don't believe anyone here could seriously pick out the difference at full speed and you are just trying to invent ways of critisizing a movie... or trying to justify your own moot points...

bagging a popular movie to be cool, is only cool until the movie becomes unpopular then the people who like it are alternative and you are the sheep.

Originally posted by Stormwalker

as for the use of CG in the movie.. it is justified! and it looks fine.. i have been doing graphics and working with video for 3 years... and i had to stop the movie and go through frame by frame with zoom to pick out the faults (and thats on a new widescreen television)... and if you can seriously pick out a single frame that is moving at 1/25th of a second then your basically a physical anomolie.. FACT your eyes cant take in information that quickly.. as for the frames in succession.. if you can pick out that skin tone and texture is noticably different from the wide angles then you're lying... dont waste our time. point is.. i don't believe anyone here could seriously pick out the difference at full speed and you are just trying to invent ways of critisizing a movie... or trying to justify your own moot points...


Hmmm so what your saying is that without a big TV, slowmotion and Zoom im lying when i say that Neo and the Smiths was badly Animated and loked fake?

Are you saying that the CGI used looks 100% like real life if its not big, slow, and zoomed?

Fed7haS

Fed7haS

No, he isn't exactly saying that.

What he's talking about is what is knows as SHADERS. A Shader is the property given to a 3D object to identify how the object is supposed to react to light.

For example, if you created a CG character, and gave his hand a skin texture, this is not enough. You've to define other properties which make our skin look real, like blood pressure, effect of humidity, etc...

So if we have a 30" screen, the Agent's head will be occupying probably not more than 2 inches wide for a full-body shot. This small area wouldn't give you the chance to say that the skin looks fake, that details in the head are missing and so on.

Originally posted by Stormwalker
bagging a popular movie to be cool, is only cool until the movie becomes unpopular then the people who like it are alternative and you are the sheep.

Yeah! What he said! :P

Originally posted by Stormwalker
the only comment that i disagreed with was carl's opinion about the burly brawl.. 5 SMITHS!!! the whole point is smith is taking over the matrix.. any fool could see that coming.. and its hinted at big time in the last trailer for revolutions... how on earth could 5 smiths pose a threat to the matrix.. .well duh.. they need more.. much more.. and if you were in smiths position and had the ability to clone yourself would you stop at 5.. give me a break! if you're going to pick on that.. at least pick on the fact that the smiths just walk away at the end of the fight!
Erm there could have been 50Billion Smith's for all I care, but did Neo have to fight them all. Suddenly what could have been a well choreographed fight scene, became a mess of CGI, with a bad guy who wasn't scary because the hero could take on him a million times and still have it easy. Not a good thing, because even the fact that Smith is never ending, Neo just fly's away as soon as he get's bored so no danger. All those Smith's in one fight was a baaaaad idea. Incidentally it's not about hating Reloaded to be cool, it's about hating it for being a crap film, with a crap story, crap acting and crap kung fu. :rolleyes:

And I'm not making anything up, the effects looked VERY Fake.

http://www.virtualcinematography.org/publications/acrobat/Lighting-s2003.pdf

Another thing in Reloadet is when Morphius sticks his sword into the truck.... hehe he putes in 1 arms length down and then jumps down on it to catch the keymaker... right then the sword is so far down that morphius`s head isent over the top of the truck :P hehe so unless his arm is 6 feet long then there is a serius problem with this scene :) 1 minuts later when he puls it out again its nice to se it back up at 1 arm lengt so he can reatch it :)

Fed7haS

Sometimes it's a glitch in the matrix...and sometimes it's a goof. Who can forget the doorknob shot goof in the original (they disguise the camera by dressing it up as Morpheus...even though Morpheus is right next to it).

CGI= crappy .
In all the CGI shots it looked like no one had joints, just bends like GUMBY.
Wireframe9, if you are indeed going to be one of the next generations effect technicians then take this to mind, if we can point out your work then you aren’t doing your job. Simple as that.

Dr.FrankNFurter i never noticed that :D ill have to re-watch it when i eventually decide to buy it (i'm waiting exrental so i dont have to pay full price) :D

Joel Silver admits all, "we rushed Matrix Reloaded so that could get all the question points in there ready for Matrix Revolutions."
He admitted it on UK film review show "Film 2003". At least he's honest.